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Tema: Lchf/ paleo/primal - prehrana

  1. #651

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    ali to je stvarno bezbroj mogucnosti! povrce, hej, povrce, sve osim onoga koje raste pod zemljom, ali i to bih ja dopustila sirovo. malo me cude ljudi koji kad im kazem da ne jedem zitarice i krumpir pitaju a sto pobogu jedes no onda mi je i jasno zasto i otkud toliko problema s probavom, kilazom i sl.

    kuhano, peceno, punjeno, rolano, na salatu sirovo, na salatu kuhano.... mislim, divota!

  2. #652

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    hm, ja sam odgovarala anemoni, ali presporo

  3. #653
    Osoblje foruma sirius avatar
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    Da ne spominjemo da su se granice u laboratorijima za kolesterol i trigliceride spustale sa godinama, posebno kad su u opticaj krenuli lijekovi koji snizavaju masnoca .

  4. #654
    Osoblje foruma sirius avatar
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    Citiraj Anemona prvotno napisa Vidi poruku
    Ako imaš prilike provjeri.
    Prehrana kod problema s žuči je puna bijelih gluposti, a nema masnoća, nema jaja,...
    Npr. konkretno ja nemam nikad povišene masnoće, ali imam preporuku nemasne hrane (bez jaja i ostalo), a s druge strane bih htjela izbaciti večinu glutena i što mi preostaje?
    Kako se "najesti", tj. zadovoljiti potrebe organizma?
    Anemona, nemam iskustva, ali jedino ti preostaje pretrazivati internet . Vidjeti kakva se alternativna prehrana prepoporucuje . Pa isprobati , vidjeti da li ti odgovara, ako ti se čini da ima logike.

  5. #655
    anchie76 avatar
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    Potražila sam više info o žitaricama nakon ovog komentara Ivane

    meni je takav nacin prehrane vec dugo lifestyle, ali mi je ta isključivost nesimpatična
    To što je žitarice lako proizvesti i s njima lako prehraniti puuuuno ljudi (a o visoko procesiranim proizvodima od žitarica da ne govorimo) ne znači nužno da je to najbolji način prehrane za ljude. Kome se da čitati (nezgodno je iskopirano, ali vrijedno čitanja), isječak iz knjige Primal blueprint (poglavlje 5, lakše će vam biti čitati na linku) o tome zašto je loše bazirati prehranu na žitaricama

    Going Against the Grain
    Perhaps the most harmful element of dietary Conventional Wisdom is that
    grains are healthy—the “staff of life”—as we’ve been led to believe our entire
    lives. While grains enjoy massive global popularity today, they are simply not
    very healthy for human consumption. From two million years ago, when the
    first Homo erectus arose and began the steady evolution to the appearance of the
    first modern Homo sapiens between 200,000 and 100,000 years ago, and
    continuing until about 10,000 years ago, humans existed entirely as huntergatherers. Depending on where they roamed, early Homo sapiens derived their
    nutrition from as many as 200 different wild food sources, including animal
    meats, fruits, vegetables, and nuts and seeds, but grains were notably absent.
    Starting about 10,000 years ago, forces conspired to create a dramatic shift in
    the human diet. The widespread extinction of large mammals on major continents
    coupled with increases in population forced humans to become more resourceful
    in obtaining food. Those living by water utilized rafts, canoes, nets, and better
    fishing tools to enjoy more bounty. On land, humans refined their toolmaking and
    hunting strategies to include more birds and small mammals in the food supply.
    Escalating competition for animal-sourced food eventually led to agricultural
    innovations sprouting up independently in the most advanced societies around the
    world (Egyptians, Mayans, etc.). As wild grains (which were a very small part of
    some diets but difficult to harvest for any significant yield) became domesticated,
    humans derived more and more calories from these readily available high-calorie
    sources, a trend that has continued to the present day—with dire consequences.
    Loren Cordain, Ph.D., author of the 2002 best-seller The Paleo Diet, explains:
    Cereal grains [meaning cultivated grains in general, not breakfast cereals] have
    fundamentally altered the foods to which our species had been originally adapted
    over eons of evolutionary experience. For better or for worse, we are no longer
    hunter-gatherers. However, our genetic makeup is still that of a paleolithic huntergatherer, a species whose nutritional requirements are optimally adapted to wild
    meats, fruits and vegetables, not to cereal grains. There is a significant body of
    evidence which suggests that cereal grains are less than optimal foods for humans and that the human genetic makeup and physiology may not be fully adapted to
    high levels of cereal grain consumption. We have wandered down a path toward
    absolute dependence upon cereal grains, a path for which there is no return.
    Culturally, the cultivation of grains is the key variable that allowed modern
    civilization to develop and thrive. Families could successfully feed and raise more
    children. Large populations could now live permanently in proximity, and labor
    could specialize, leading to continued exponential advancements in knowledge
    and modernization. However, as Cordain elaborates, “[Grains] have allowed
    man’s culture to grow and evolve so that man has become earth’s dominant
    animal species, but this preeminence has not occurred without cost.… Agriculture
    is generally agreed to be responsible for many of humanity’s societal ills,
    including whole-scale warfare, starvation, tyranny, epidemic diseases, and class
    divisions.” Dr. Jared Diamond, evolutionary biologist, physiologist, and Pulitzer
    Prize–winning professor of geography at UCLA, and author of Guns, Germs and
    Steel, goes so far as to say that agriculture was “the worst mistake in the history of
    the human race” and that “we’re still struggling with the mess into which
    agriculture has tumbled us, and it’s unclear whether we can solve it.”
    Grain’s singular benefit of plentiful calories was often more than offset by
    harmful aspects, including “antinutrients” (compounds that interfere with the
    absorption of beneficial nutrients), the high carb content, and grain proteins that
    were foreign to the human digestive process. Populations may have expanded, but
    health costs to the individual were significant. The flourishing of agriculture
    paralleled a reduction in average human life span as well as body and brain size,
    increases in infant mortality and infectious diseases, and the occurrence of
    previously unknown conditions such as osteoporosis, bone mineral disorders, and
    malnutrition. Ironically, as medical advancements have eliminated most of the
    rudimentary health risks faced by early humans (infant mortality, infections, etc.),
    we can now live long enough to develop, suffer, and die from diet-related
    diseases, including atherosclerosis, hypertension, and type 2 diabetes (it used to
    be called adult-onset diabetes until millions of kids started developing it in recent
    years!).

    The Base of the Disease Pyramid
    Grains offer the great majority of their calories in the form of carbohydrate,
    so they cause blood sugar levels to elevate quickly (foods that easily and rapidly
    elevate blood sugar are known as high glycemic foods). Because high glycemic
    foods, such as sugar and grains, have been recently and suddenly introduced to
    the human food supply (that’s right, even 10,000 years ago is “recent and sudden”
    in evolutionary terms) and yet are consumed in massive quantities, they shock our
    delicate hormonal systems, which are better suited to ingesting the low-glycemic
    foods our ancestors ate, such as meat, vegetables, nuts, and most fruits.
    A grain-heavy diet stresses the all-important insulin regulation mechanism in
    the body. After consuming that bagel, scone, muffin, French toast, or bowl of cereal (all derived from grains) and a glass of juice for breakfast, your pancreas
    releases insulin into the bloodstream to help regulate blood sugar levels. Even
    after the routine meal just described, many Americans technically become
    temporarily diabetic, with blood sugar levels soaring to clinically dangerous
    levels. You know the drill by now. After your meal, insulin is released into the
    bloodstream and stores glucose as muscle glycogen or directs its conversion to
    fat. Experience this often enough and it’s very likely you’ll gain weight and
    develop insulin resistance and Metabolic Syndrome.
    If, instead, you were to have a Primal Blueprint breakfast consisting of a
    delicious cheese-and-vegetable omelet with some fresh berries, you would enjoy a
    moderated insulin response, leading to balanced energy levels for the hours after
    your meal instead of a sugar high and insulin crash. Furthermore, with blood
    sugar levels balanced, you would be able to access and burn stored body fat for
    energy until your next insulin-balanced meal.

    Phytates We Hate
    There is sufficient evidence that this overreliance on grains—as well as on
    simple carb and sugar products in general—leads to numerous vitamin, mineral,
    and nutritional deficiencies. Most grains contain substances called phytates that
    easily bind to important minerals like calcium, magnesium, and zinc in the
    digestive tract, making them more difficult to absorb. Ironically, the
    unprocessed—and, therefore, supposedly healthier—“whole” grains are typically
    the highest in phytates. Mineral deficiencies are common in underdeveloped
    nations that depend almost entirely on grain for their sustenance (bread accounts
    for 50 percent of the total calories consumed in at least half the countries in the
    world; some populations derive up to 80 percent of total calories from grain
    products).
    Grains also play a role in interference with vitamin D metabolism and in
    related deficiencies of vitamins A, C, and B12. These nutrients are not present in
    grains (again, ironically, unless they have been processed and then “fortified” by
    adding back the missing vitamins—albeit at a much reduced bioavailability).
    Deficiencies of these basic vitamins are prevalent mainly in third-world countries
    (see the recurring theme?). However, even Western eaters with more balanced
    diets, but who still rely too heavily on grains, miss out on eating more nutritious
    foods, such as meats, fruits, and vegetables. In the United States, 45 percent of
    citizens get zero daily servings of fruit or juice and 22 percent get no daily
    vegetables.

    Gluten, Lectin—Immune Affectin’
    Certain grain (and also some dairy) proteins mimic those found in viruses
    and bacteria, triggering an immune response when ingested. Gluten—the large,
    water-soluble protein that creates the elasticity in dough (it’s also the primary glue in wallpaper paste)— is found in most common grains, such as wheat, rye, and
    barley. Researchers now believe that as many as a third of us are probably glutenintolerant or gluten-sensitive.That third of us (and I would suspect many more on
    a subclinical level) “react” to gluten with a perceptible inflammatory response.
    Over time, those who are known to be gluten-intolerant can develop a dismal
    array of medical conditions: dermatitis, joint pain, reproductive problems, acid
    reflux and other digestive conditions, autoimmune disorders, and (kršitelj koda)c disease.
    And that still doesn’t mean that the rest of us aren’t experiencing some milder
    negative effect that simply doesn’t manifest itself so obviously.
    Grains also contain high levels of mild, natural plant toxins known as lectins.
    Researchers have found that lectins can inhibit healthy gastrointestinal function
    by damaging delicate brush borders that allow appropriate forms of nutrients
    (glucose, amino acids, fats, vitamins, and minerals) to travel from the digestive
    tract into the bloodstream. Lectin damage allows larger, undigested protein
    molecules to infiltrate the bloodstream. The ever-vigilant immune system sees
    these unfamiliar protein molecules (not necessarily lectins, but anything you
    ingest that was supposed to be fully processed in the digestive tract before
    entering the bloodstream) and sets up a typical immune response to deal with
    them. Unfortunately, these undigested protein molecules can resemble molecules
    that reside on the outside of healthy cells, leaving your immune system confused
    as to who the real enemy is. When your healthy cells come under attack by a
    confused immune system, you experience what is known as an autoimmune
    response, something experts believe is the root cause of many diseases.

    The Holes in the Whole Grain Story
    Many health-conscious eaters are well aware of the drawbacks of eating
    refined wheat flour, white rice, pasta, and other grains that have been stripped of
    their natural fiber and other nutrients during the manufacturing process. While a
    refined grain product will (in most cases) produce a higher glycemic response
    than a whole grain food (because fiber delays the absorption process and mutes
    the blood sugar effect), a whole grain might well be considered less healthy than
    its stripped-down cousin for many other reasons.
    By definition, whole grains are those that have all three edible components
    intact: the endosperm (starchy), the bran (fibrous), and the germ (oily). As we
    learned earlier in this chapter, many whole grains contain harmful phytates,
    glutens, and lectins that promote inflammation and offend your immune and
    digestive systems. While you also get that highly touted dose of fiber from your
    whole grains, this, too, can be seen as a negative. Contrary to Conventional
    Wisdom, excessive fiber intake (practically automatic when you emphasize whole
    grains) can increase appetite and interfere with healthy digestion, mineral
    absorption, and elimination. (I detail the drawbacks of consuming too much fiber
    in the Primal Blueprint Q&A at MarksDailyApple.com.) You can obtain optimal
    amounts of fiber (and eliminate the risk of overdoing it) from emphasizing vegetables and fruits à la the Primal Blueprint.
    When you ingest a refined product, such as Wonder bread, soda, or candy,
    you get empty calories and a big insulin hit—but that’s all you get. Furthermore,
    the total glycemic load is the same for a slice of white bread as it is a slice of
    whole wheat bread. True, the wheat bread might burn a little slower, but you
    eventually produce the same amount of insulin to deal with the glucose load. The
    only thing in whole grain’s favor is a very minimal amount of protein and a few
    micronutrients. However, the nutritional advantages of eating whole grains are
    simply insignificant—especially in comparison to any vegetable, fruit, nut, seed,
    or organic animal food with far more nutritional value calorie for calorie (and,
    unlike whole grains, they also taste good!)—and free of objectionable agents.
    For purposes of weight control and preventing disease, a gram of carb from a
    whole grain is no better than a gram from a refined grain. I’m not suggesting that
    you choose refined grains over whole grains; I’m suggesting you ditch all grains
    in favor of Primal Blueprintfoods. That said, the next time you are faced with the
    option to eat grains, and you rationalize that whole grains are a step up from
    Wonder bread and soda, be sure you understand the “whole” story.

    Say Good-Bye to Fatigue, Illness, and Suffering
    Understanding that the long-term effects of chronic hyperinsulinemia (high
    insulin levels in the bloodstream) are such conditions as general systemic
    inflammation, obesity, diabetes, heart disease, and cancer should be enough to
    convince you that it is critical to pursue a more natural way of eating. Eating lowcarbohydrate, grain-free meals will not only result in immediate gratification in
    the form of regulated energy levels, but it can help you succeed with long-term
    weight management and quite possibly save your life.
    As a reminder, insulin is a “master hormone” that regulates the metabolism
    of fat and carbohydrate in your body. The single most important requirement to
    improve your fat metabolism and succeed with long-term weight management is
    to normalize and balance the general amount of insulin you produce. High insulin
    levels promote fat storage and disease. Moderated insulin levels (typical
    with Primal Blueprint eating) stimulate fat burning and good health. It’s that
    simple.
    At the risk of sounding overly dramatic or redundant on this position, we
    must understand that the reasonable, “evolutionary” voice challenging
    Conventional Wisdom about grains is being battled by billions of dollars in
    corporate and government propaganda pushing us to conform to dietary habits
    that we are not suited for, that do not nourish us, and that are downright
    destructive to human health. As Professor Diamond reminds us, humanity is very
    far down a disastrous road, and righting course is incredibly problematic.
    If you are one of the fortunate folks who are less sensitive to glutens, lectins,
    and phytates than most, you might take exception to my wholesale damning of
    foods that are a dietary centerpiece across the globe. Absent acute symptoms, I’ll still argue that we are all genetically “allergic” in some way to foods that are not
    aligned with the Primal Blueprint. Perhaps you can try eliminating grains for 30
    or 60 days, taking note of any general improvements in your condition. I’ll bet
    your energy will be more regulated after meals, your digestion and elimination
    will improve, and the frequency of minor illnesses or inflammation conditions
    will subside, and you will be more successful controlling your weight. There
    simply are no good reasons to base your diet on grains— and a lot of reasons
    never to eat much grains for the rest of your life.

  6. #656
    anchie76 avatar
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    Citiraj sirius prvotno napisa Vidi poruku
    Da ne spominjemo da su se granice u laboratorijima za kolesterol i trigliceride spustale sa godinama, posebno kad su u opticaj krenuli lijekovi koji snizavaju masnoca .
    Apsolutno! Farmaceutska industrija mora zaraditi

  7. #657
    magriz avatar
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    Citiraj anchie76 prvotno napisa Vidi poruku
    Apsolutno! Farmaceutska industrija mora zaraditi
    i prehrambena još prije

  8. #658
    anchie76 avatar
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    takoe. Izvrsna je zarada od visoko procesiranih namirnica. Nikome nije u interesu da se ljudi hrane izvornom neprocesiranom hranom, tu velike industrije ne profitiraju.

  9. #659
    jelena.O avatar
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    Citiraj anchie76 prvotno napisa Vidi poruku
    ako ga ne unosiš dovoljno prehranom tijelo ga samo proizvodi
    na koji način ga tijelo proizvede?

  10. #660
    Osoblje foruma sirius avatar
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    Citiraj jelena.O prvotno napisa Vidi poruku
    na koji način ga tijelo proizvede?
    http://www.building-body.com/zašto-s...problemom.html

  11. #661
    Roza avatar
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    A što jesti nakon intenzivnog treninga (npr. Insanity)? preporuca li se uopce kakvo jelo? Standardba preporuka su UH, sto ovdje ne dolazi u obzir.

  12. #662
    Osoblje foruma Bubica avatar
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    jezi ga, ja dva dana imam crijevnu virozu - jedva sam nesto stavila u usta, ali to sto sam stavila bili su ugljikohidrati, tj. malo kruha, ne mogu zamisliti da, npr. nesto drugo stavim u usta. Je li tko rjesavao ovakvu situaciju?

  13. #663
    ribice avatar
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    Roza ni u insanity programu prehrane ne preporuča se bijela tjestenina, bijeli kruh ili čisti šećer koliko pamtim.
    Važno je za insanity da se jedu 5 manjih obroka ali mora se paziti da ne bude preveliki razmak da se ne ogladni previše i da su dobro iskombinirani sastojci.
    Za insanity treba hrpa energije jer se po vježbi može i do 1000 kalorija izgubiti i treba biti oprezan s hranom jer je potrebna jako velika količina dobre energije da bi se izdražao trening.

  14. #664
    mala-vila avatar
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    bubica i ja sam imala, jedan dan doduše i to sam prepisala novom režimu LCHF, no zaključila sam da sam možda premasno napravila, nemam pojma
    uglavnom ja nisam mogla niš jesti, ne znam kako ti mozes
    kupila sam si chia sjemenke, to preporučam svakom bez obzira na način prehrane

  15. #665
    anchie76 avatar
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    Citiraj Roza prvotno napisa Vidi poruku
    A što jesti nakon intenzivnog treninga (npr. Insanity)? preporuca li se uopce kakvo jelo? Standardba preporuka su UH, sto ovdje ne dolazi u obzir.
    Ja bih se vodila tvojim osobnim feelingom, ako ti se ne jede poslije nemoj, ako ti se jede onda se naklopaj što i inače jedeš. Meni osobno nakon jakih treninga ne paše jesti. Rijeeeetko mi se dogodi da bih jela, al onda bih pojela npr jogurt ili tako nešto. Nekad kad sam baš gladna poslije (to mi se dogodi ako odgađam obrok zbog treninga), onda se naklopam normalno što bih i inače jela za taj obrok.

  16. #666
    anchie76 avatar
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    Wow, nevjerojatno je vidjeti da mainstream mediji počinju pisati loše o pšenici

    http://zadovoljna.dnevnik.hr/clanak/...---280148.html

  17. #667
    Freyja avatar
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    Smeta li kome od vas taj neki čudan osjećaj (u grlu, trbuhu) nakon pojedenog masnijeg obroka? Ja recimo svaki takav obrok moram dopuniti ukiseljenim daikonom ili kiselim krastavcima. A ono što sam nedavno otkrila (jako je fino) je sok/čaj od đumbira s limunom. Naribam đumbir, prelijem kipućom vodom i nakon pet minuta procijedim, dodam sok jednog limuna i ako je prekiselo dodam sasvim malo stevije u prahu (i, naravno, dodam još vode jer bi bilo jako intenzivno). Prefino. S time da ja stavim toliko đumbira da mi "gori" u grlu dok pijem. Inače, od ponedjeljka sam na lchf-u, kilogram i pol lakša (i prošli sam put, kada sam nekoliko mjeseci bila na lchf-u, nevjerojatno brzo mršavila), vježbam, ne večeram i super se osjećam.

  18. #668
    Freyja avatar
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    Citiraj anchie76 prvotno napisa Vidi poruku
    Wow, nevjerojatno je vidjeti da mainstream mediji počinju pisati loše o pšenici

    http://zadovoljna.dnevnik.hr/clanak/...---280148.html
    Vezano uz pšenicu, ja sam puna prištića kada je konzumiram (i bilo koju drugu žitaricu s glutenom).

  19. #669
    anchie76 avatar
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    Citiraj Freyja prvotno napisa Vidi poruku
    Smeta li kome od vas taj neki čudan osjećaj (u grlu, trbuhu) nakon pojedenog masnijeg obroka? Ja recimo svaki takav obrok moram dopuniti ukiseljenim daikonom ili kiselim krastavcima. A ono što sam nedavno otkrila (jako je fino) je sok/čaj od đumbira s limunom. Naribam đumbir, prelijem kipućom vodom i nakon pet minuta procijedim, dodam sok jednog limuna i ako je prekiselo dodam sasvim malo stevije u prahu (i, naravno, dodam još vode jer bi bilo jako intenzivno). Prefino. S time da ja stavim toliko đumbira da mi "gori" u grlu dok pijem. Inače, od ponedjeljka sam na lchf-u, kilogram i pol lakša (i prošli sam put, kada sam nekoliko mjeseci bila na lchf-u, nevjerojatno brzo mršavila), vježbam, ne večeram i super se osjećam.
    ja đumbir obožavam, najčešće ga naribam na zelenu salatu Ali kako se dobro slaže uz ribu, losos pogotovo, ajmeeee ludilo dobro

  20. #670
    Anemona avatar
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    Citiraj ivana7997 prvotno napisa Vidi poruku
    ali to je stvarno bezbroj mogucnosti! povrce, hej, povrce, sve osim onoga koje raste pod zemljom, ali i to bih ja dopustila sirovo. malo me cude ljudi koji kad im kazem da ne jedem zitarice i krumpir pitaju a sto pobogu jedes no onda mi je i jasno zasto i otkud toliko problema s probavom, kilazom i sl.

    kuhano, peceno, punjeno, rolano, na salatu sirovo, na salatu kuhano.... mislim, divota!
    Ovo je istina, tako i jedem, ali moje pitanje je bilo vezano za zdrave masnoće kod ljudi s žučnim problemima.
    Radi se o tome da svaki dr. odmah stavi zabranu na sve vrste masti, a meni logika govori da to ne može nikako biti dobro.
    I sad kad izbaciš i gluten iz formule, ne preostaje ništa za "podebljati" obrok.

    Dodatak: parametri masti iz krvi su uvijek ok.
    Posljednje uređivanje od Anemona : 04.04.2013. at 10:54

  21. #671
    anchie76 avatar
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    I meni logika govori da to ne može biti dobro. Koji točno problem imaš sa žuči? ajde napiši pa ćemo tražiti skupa info

  22. #672
    Anemona avatar
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    Citiraj anchie76 prvotno napisa Vidi poruku
    I meni logika govori da to ne može biti dobro. Koji točno problem imaš sa žuči? ajde napiši pa ćemo tražiti skupa info
    Imam "mulj" u žuči koji za sad ne radi probleme, iliti imala sam jednu epizodu problema.
    Pa preventivno trebam paziti na prehranu. Ne tako strogu kao ljudi s žučnim kamenima, ali paziti.
    Trigliceridi i slično mi nikad nisu bili povišeni.

  23. #673
    anchie76 avatar
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    http://www.webmedicina.org/bolesti-s...kamena-u-zuci-
    U većini slučajeva nastanka kamena u žuči uzrok je holesterol. Istraživanja su pokazala da je holesterol uzrok u čak tri četvrtine slučajeva.Holesterol sačinjava samo pet posto žuči, ne otapa se lako, ali da bi ostao u tečnosti mora biti u ravnoteži sa žučnim solima. Ako jetra luči previše holesterola dolazi do zastoja i formiranja mulja u žučnoj kesi, odnosno do prezasićenja. Tada se holesterol može nataložiti i može doći do stvaranja žučnih kamenaca.
    E sad ovako laički gledano, jetra proizvodi kolesterol orilo gorilo jer ga organizmu puno treba, i što manje unosimo prehranom, to više ona proizvodi. Meni bi common sense bio da onda probaš što više prehranom unijeti, da jetra mora manje proizvoditi.

    dalje, ovi kažu o nastajanju kamenca i mulja

    The liver produces bile, which is composed of bile acids, cholesterol, and a few other substances. This bile travels from the liver to the gall bladder—a little sack tucked beneath the liver—through a small tube called the hepatic duct. The gall bladder stores the bile and waits for a fatty meal to enter the small intestine. When the fatty meal arrives, the gall bladder squeezes the bile out through the bile duct (another small tube) that joins with the hepatic duct to form the common duct and empties into the upper end of the small intestine. So when the fatty meal arrives, the gall bladder douses it with the bile it has been storing for just this occasion. The bile then mixes with the fat and breaks it down for absorption as described above.
    If very few fatty meals come down the tract—for example, if the owner of the GI tract is following the Ornish or other low-fat diet—the bile sits around in the gall bladder, unsquirted. The liver continues to make bile, but slows down a little in its production. The cholesterol component of the bile tends to become more concentrated with time and can ultimately become supersaturated and precipitate as a small cholesterol gallstone (cholesterol accounts for 80-90% of gallstones).
    As you can see based on the different relative risks above, the factor that shows the greatest relative risk is not the glycemic index "which was weak”nor even the glycemic load, but was just the plain old non-sexy total carbohydrate intake.
    Citiraj zakljucak tog istraživanja prvotno napisa
    Our findings suggest that a high intake of carbohydrate, glycaemic load, and glycaemic index increases the risk of symptomatic gall stone disease among men. These results add to the concern that low fat, high carbohydrate diets may not be an optimal dietary recommendation
    Pročitaj cijeli članak, vrijedi čitanja

    Ovaj članak, low carb and gallstones
    In a study of 51 obese people using an extremely low fat low calorie diet (just one gram of fat a day!) the gallbladder was examined by ultrasound before the diet and after one and two months. After one month four of the 51 participants had developed new gallstones. After two months more than one in four (13 people) had new gallstones! This on an almost fat free diet. Three participants needed to have their gallbladder removed during the study.

    A similar study examined 19 people
    eating an extremely low fat low calorie diet over 16 weeks. At the ultrasound examination at the end of the study five people (again about one in four) had new gallstones

    A third study
    compared an extremely low fat diet with a diet slightly higher in fat during 3 months. More than one in two (6 of 11 people) in the group eating extremely low fat developed new gallstones. Nobody in the group eating more fat did.

    Conclusion: Do you want gallstones? Avoid fat.

    What happens if you do the opposite?

    What if you were to do the opposite of the usual advice? Regularly eat food with fat in it? Then more bile will be used to digest the food. The bile ducts and the gallbladder will be flushed through regularly. Probably no stones will have time to form, and pre-existing stones might (if you are lucky) be flushed out into the small intestine.
    The risk is that you will get gallstone pain in the short term – if you already have gallstones.
    The question is: Do you want to think short-term (low fat) or long-term (higher fat)?

    Does high fat food work?

    It’s logical to think that food higher in fat can result in a gall bladder free from gallstones. But as far as I know no study has tested high fat food to people with gallstones.
    On the other hand I know quite a few people who have experienced that their gallstone disease disappeared on a LCHF diet. Sometimes at the expense of initial gallstone attacks though.


    Ovaj članak NY times- health kaže o prevenciji

    Sugar. High intake of sugar has been associated with an increased risk for gallstones. Diets that are high in carbohydrates (such as pasta and bread) can also increase risk, because carbohydrates are converted to sugar in the body
    I ovaj članak mi se čini vrlo zanimljiv http://www.westonaprice.org/ask-the-doctor/gall-stones

    ------------------------------------------------------

    Čitajući sve ovo, nameće mi se i to da je stvaranje kamenca (mulja) upalni proces. Ako znamo da velike količine omega 6 dovode do razno raznih upalnih procesa u tijelu (omega 6 ima najviše u procesiranim namirnicama, i recimo suncokretovo ulje koje ima strašno puno omega 6), onda uz redovni unos masnoća naravno treba paziti i koje masnoće se unose da se smanji rizik upala.


    Samo jedna rečenica iz cijelog članka (pročitaj ga cijelog jer jako dobro pojašnjava problem s omega 6 )


    Nedostatak omege 3 zbog pretjeranog unosa omege 6 iz žitarica i biljnih ulja, dovodi do prevladavanja loših eikosanoida i stvaranja kroničnih upalnih procesa koji su uzročnik upalnih bolesti.


  24. #674
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    Ne znam, na tvom mjestu ja bih probala sa LCHF i kontrolirala stanje, tako najbolje saznaš na čemu si.

  25. #675
    anchie76 avatar
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    Zanimljiv članak

    http://eatlocalgrown.com/article/112...many-ills.html


    If you have any of the following symptoms it could be a sign that you have gluten intolerance:


    1. Digestive issues such as gas, bloating, diarrhea and even constipation. I see the constipation particularly in children after eating gluten.
    2. Keratosis Pilaris, (also known as ‘chicken skin’ on the back of your arms). This tends be as a result of a fatty acid deficiency and vitamin A deficiency secondary to fat-malabsorption caused by gluten damaging the gut.
    3. Fatigue, brain fog or feeling tired after eating a meal that contains gluten.
    4. Diagnosis of an autoimmune disease such as Hashimoto’s thyroiditis, Rheumatoid arthritis, Ulcerative colitis, Lupus, Psoriasis, Scleroderma or Multiple sclerosis.
    5. Neurologic symptoms such as dizziness or feeling of being off balance.
    6. Hormone imbalances such as PMS, PCOS or unexplained infertility.
    7. Migraine headaches.
    8. Diagnosis of chronic fatigue or fibromyalgia. These diagnoses simply indicate your conventional doctor cannot pin point the cause of your fatigue or pain.
    9. Inflammation, swelling or pain in your joints such as fingers, knees or hips.
    10. Mood issues such as anxiety, depression, mood swings and ADD.

  26. #676

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    Citiraj anchie76 prvotno napisa Vidi poruku
    ne možeš povjerovati koje sve gadosti može uzrokovati gluten

    ja odgovorno tvrdim da sam se riješila latentne depresije i letargije od kad sam gluten free. ne bih to dvoje nikad povezala sa žitaricama, ali nemam drugog objašnjenja za promjenu u raspoloženju zadnjih mjeseci

  27. #677
    anchie76 avatar
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    Da, i sad kad pogledaš koliko ljudi u današnje vrijeme ima problema sa štitnjačom

    Evo priča jedne cure koja je riješila hashimotov sindrom (štitnjača) promjenom prehrane http://robbwolf.com/2012/05/18/paleo...mmune-illness/

    I komentar ispod

    Nice blog. I diagnose on average 5-6 Hashimotos cases per week in my center. The fist thing we do is get them off of ALL gluten. The 2nd test we run is the Cyrex array 3 which tells me if other tissues are involved such as the brain and heart. (kršitelj koda)cs (Gut) is only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to AI and gluten. 100% of them have developed hyper permeable gut function and if they turn up positive on the array3 with antibodies to the gut they will have to maintain a lifelong vigil to keep their intestinal mucosal barrier intact. The Paleo diet goes a long way in helping them achieve this.

  28. #678
    NanoiBeba avatar
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    Ja sam totalno skrenula s puta i nikako se vratiti.

    bila sam nekim poslom do Slovenije, i ušla u Hoffer - 200 g prefinih indijskih oraščića - 2,5 eura. Nisam niti kuži
    a koliko je cijena niska, tako da nisam uzela zalihe.

  29. #679
    anchie76 avatar
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    Ajde ajde vrati se Gdje je taj hoffer, i jel ima tamo kokosovog brašna?

  30. #680
    NanoiBeba avatar
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    pokušavam.

    Bila sam jučer u Brežicama. To je jeftini dućan tipa Lidl. Nisam puno gledala. uzela sam samo dvije vrećice indijskih (bedak, umjesto cijele kile, da ne velim više - ali bez naočala nisam vidjela jesu li slani- ne volim slane) i mali paketić macadamije i to neslane- to u zagrebu niakda nisam našla, osim one kratkotrajne akcije u lidlu, ali je tada macadamija bila neočišćena, a ljuska joj je tako tvrda da ju jedva razbijem

  31. #681
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    Makadamiju si kupila!! Koliko košta?

  32. #682
    NanoiBeba avatar
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    Imaš macadamije u Mulleru, ali je soljena ili sa wasabijem
    ova je prazna. Nisam zapamtila cijenu, ali je sigurno jeftinija nego u Zgbu. Bacila sam račun.

    ja obožavam orašaste plodove a dajem ih i djeci, pa ih stalno negdje kupijem. Isto sam prije par mjeseci bila u Lidlu u Sloveniji i isto su imali puno veći izbor nego kod nas. Jedino sada više ne znam jesu li bil prženi i slani.

  33. #683
    marta avatar
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    Makadamije je prije pod normalno bilo za kupiti u Getrou. Sad vise ne znam ni dal taj ducan jos postoji , a kamoli ima li makadamije. A da su to genijalni orascici - jesu.

  34. #684
    Osoblje foruma sirius avatar
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    Getro postoji, ali ne znam za dotične orascice. Moglo bi ih biti u Metrou.

  35. #685
    NanoiBeba avatar
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    Nikada nigdje osim u Mulleru nisam vidjela makadamije. Ja sam ih kupovala u Austriji.
    zna biti u Lidlu ali su močeni u med. Tamo je bilo samo onih u ljusci.

    joj, kako nisam skužila makadamije u wasabiju. Lijepo doma otvorim vrećicu. Krenem s klincima grickati - užas. No barem otada znamo što je wasabi

  36. #686
    Osoblje foruma Danci_Krmed avatar
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    Hoffer ima i u Kopru, vidjela sam ga jednom ali nisam nikad išla unutra. Vrijedi probati
    Gledala sam orašaste plodove u Italiji u Coop-u, cijene su li-la sa našima, nema neke razlike.

  37. #687
    NanoiBeba avatar
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    je ne idem u špeceraj preko granice, ali kada mi je na putu, volim baciti oko. Kupovina uvijek završi s par paketića orašastih plodova, kojom novom vrstom sira i čokoladom za djecu

    Ali ispred na blagajni su bili zagrepčani koji su bome napravili dobar špeceraj. I letimičan pogled na cijene je pokazao da je fakat dosta niže nego kod nas.

  38. #688

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    Već sam više puta bila u pekari kupit svojima kruh otkad sam na lchfu. Ali jučeeeeer, majketi ušla u jedan preopremljeni mlinar, te kiflice, lisnata i peciva su me tako iznapadali, ajme. Jedva sam sam se othrvala, a uopće više nemam problem kad netko do mene to jede. Ufffff!
    Bila sam i u mlinairima prije i nije bio problem, al što su ove jučer to poslagale, ponabacale... ponosna sam na sebe.

  39. #689

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    Ja sam bila danas na sistematskom. Kolesterol mi je blago povišen kao i inače, a trigliceridi izrazito niski (znali su i oni biti na gornjoj granici). Za kolesterol mi je doc rekao da sam do klimakterija mirna, a da onda dođem po lijekove ako bi jače rastao, a ovako da je ok.

  40. #690

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    bravo angelina

    ja imam problem da mi se kupovna hrana počela gaditi. danas sam bila u metrou i sve mi je odurno; povrće, meso...voće ajd može proći. nisam skoro ništa kupila.

    odlučila sam većinu hrane sama proizvoditi. sad kad su stigle kozice, slijede kunići, koke, purići, patke, guske...

    md sa smješkom kaže da nisam normalna. tko bi rekao da će lchf od mene učiniti seljaka

  41. #691
    ribice avatar
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    Meni nisu kupovna peciva proble, znam da su punjena s hrpom dodataka ali ona koja doma radim...mmmmm teško im odolim.
    Baš se spremam po domaće brašno u zagorje, mm je rekao da ne želi ni kile kupiti u dućanu.

  42. #692

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    Kavofob, ti si zaposlena, jel tako? Pa kako ćeš to sve stic,jos i troje djece??

  43. #693
    Osoblje foruma sirius avatar
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    Citiraj ribice prvotno napisa Vidi poruku
    Meni nisu kupovna peciva proble, znam da su punjena s hrpom dodataka ali ona koja doma radim...mmmmm teško im odolim.
    Baš se spremam po domaće brašno u zagorje, mm je rekao da ne želi ni kile kupiti u dućanu.
    Tako je i meni. Potpuno sam ravnodusna prema kupovinom pecivu ili keksima. Ali domaći kruh i kolaci , uh .
    Zato sam prestala kruh peći kod kuce , a kolace radim rijetko.

  44. #694
    anchie76 avatar
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    Citiraj kavofob prvotno napisa Vidi poruku
    bravo angelina

    ja imam problem da mi se kupovna hrana počela gaditi. danas sam bila u metrou i sve mi je odurno; povrće, meso...voće ajd može proći. nisam skoro ništa kupila.

    odlučila sam većinu hrane sama proizvoditi. sad kad su stigle kozice, slijede kunići, koke, purići, patke, guske...

    md sa smješkom kaže da nisam normalna. tko bi rekao da će lchf od mene učiniti seljaka
    Ja te u potpunosti kužim.. i rado bih da mogu svu svoju hranu sama proizvodila I da, nisam ni ja prije tako mislila, LCHF to isto učini od mene

  45. #695
    NanoiBeba avatar
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    meni se nije dogodio taj klik jer se meni kupovna hrana oduvijek gadi - npr. kupovni jogurt, a pogotovo voćni. I taj ojećaj nikada nisam imala s kim podijeliti tako da sada mogu tu pisati. Ili sir - sir u dućanu zovem plastični, iako sada ima i manjih proizvođača čiji se proizvodi nađu po dućani,ma.

    I slažem se za pekarnice - nisu meni one frka, nego domaće delicije bilo doma ili u gostima

  46. #696
    anchie76 avatar
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    Nevjerojatno mi je to koliko je mene ova prehrana ponukala da radim stvari doma. Recimo kupujem domaće mlijeko i onda radim domaći jogurt (ok starter je kupovni, ali neusporedivo mi je to). Planiram kupiti sirilo pa raditi svoju mozarellu i tako, znam da MM misli da nisam normalna

  47. #697
    anchie76 avatar
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    Ja kupujem domaće mlijeko i domaća jaja, to mi je onak najbitnije. Jaja kad vidim da su onako zdravo žuta i da mi je "kruh" cijeli žut od njih, rastopim se. Meso najvivše koristimo piletinu, tu sam isto kupovala dosta domaće, al me sekira ta žena kako mi ne nareže kako bih ja, pa tu muku mučim. Voće i povrće kupujem u trgovini i tješim se da će uskoro sezona i da ću donositi mamino. I tako, ono ne ubijam se oko toga, ali se trudim da je ipak što manje tog umjetnog.

  48. #698
    NanoiBeba avatar
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    ja domaće mlijeko kupujem godinama i ne radim jogurt nego kiselo mlijeko. konačno je i mm počeo piti to a ne kupovni jogurt. imam staklenke od džemova i stavljam ih u to, pa nosim na posao.
    jaja isto kupujem na placu, a već sam pisala da najviše volim pačja.

    Imam razgranatu listu kumica po raznim tržnicama našeg grada

    uvijek se u velikim samoposlugama čudim što sve ljudi natrpaju u svoja kolica.

  49. #699
    anchie76 avatar
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    Ma da, kad počneš tako kupovati, tj konzumirati PRAVU hranu, shvatiš da nemaš potrebe otići u supermarket (osim po kokos i bademe )

  50. #700
    jelena.O avatar
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    indijskih orašćića ima i u mercatoru sad kolka je cifra ne vem.

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